Ogre unit sizes

I was browsing the forum and everyone says it's good to set up units of 3 ogres. So is there any point of atleast 1 unit being 5 + character strong? Is it worth to pay bout 120 pts for possibly +1 str for the bull charge / spare ogres for shooting casualties ?

The bull charge is simply gravy for an ogre army. Its a nice bonus, but never spend points improving it, as it's too easy for an opponent to deny it.

I would never, never field a unit larger than 4+ character, and not often that large.

i agree i use units of 3 bulls with a character. when i first started playing with ogres i tried to make larger units work but its too many eggs in one basket. a bad panic roll and youve lost 100s of pts. also they become hard to move. small units are really the way to go if your worried about your units getting shot use a screen. when i play dwarves i take a units of 6 ogres in one rank, naked without command there sole purpose is to be shot and provide cover for my smaller units

I have considerewd the possability of One big block to the center of my army. Maybe a BSB and 7 Bulls with a standard and bellower.  a possably hefty priced unit though, at 275 just for the bulls. , Would be an interesting unit for the charge though, having fear and unit str 24. also I wondered if it may drag the shooting away from my IG's, as it's going to look threatening at least to most opponants.

It'll look threatening to most opponents until they toss a cannon through it. And your pricey ogres start falling just as readily as empire state troops. Of course, a stone thrower or a bolt thrower would work almost as well.

Hehe Reg06, I am greatly hurt by your comment that empire state troops fall readily. They are the only reliable thing in my empire army. Now, empire knights fall readily. The better the save, the more chance of failing it is a good maxim for playing empire  .

But as I said, It is just an idea i have considered, I have never put it into practise. Then again, I play friendly games, So it will never hurt to give it a bash sometime just to see it get shot down in flames(figurativley and literally, most likely).

I've found it quite usefull to field a mix of 3 man units combined with 4 man units plus heroes. one of the ogres in the 4 man units goes to the rear rank. This adds a strength bonus to the bull charge, but more importantly it gives me extra wounds before panic tests start kicking in. Also, if one ogre gets shot off the unit doesn't lose any frontage and can effectively fight for full. Also missile fire is still divided amongst the RnF and hero. This means more shots need to be fired before ogres start dropping. I did the math before I went to sea for my traineeship. Should still be on here somewhere... I think... Ish.

The 4 ogres+character is something I've used, but I'm beginning to think it only rarely really effects the combats. In combats with your tyrant, it doesn't really matter whether you have 2 or 3 ironguts backing him up- you're still probably going to destroy everything. I don't take butchers into account because they deal out the same damage as bulls (unless you've given them a magic weapon, but there are better things to spend your points on IMO). However, that 4+character really becomes important with your bruiser, who doesn't do quite the damage a tyrant does and so it will matter (more often) whether or not you get those extra 3 S6 attacks.

My experience is limited to games below 2000 pts, so I have never had the pleasure of fielding a tyrant. Looking forward to doing so in the immediate future. Still trouble finding anything outside the GW shops and they only play up to 1000, with exception 1500 pts.

Can anyone now advise how many ogres in a unit to use against Bretonnians?

3 in the bull units, because you are going to lose them. 2-3 in the leadbelcher units, because their cavalry units are so large. And 3 in the irongut units, because you need alot of good units, not a few large units.

sweet, i need all the hope i can get against damn brets.

3 in the bull units, because you are going to lose them. 2-3 in the leadbelcher units, because their cavalry units are so large. And 3 in the irongut units, because you need alot of good units, not a few large units.

Isn't that just the same advice normally given when fighting any army with Ogres? 

Not that it's not entirely correct.  I am just saying.  Less is definitely more with Ogres.  Small units are the win.

Hehe I bet brets can be quite tough againtst ogres... It's an army with mostly full knights and will mostly be charing... :S GL

Hey has anyone beaten Brets here? Know any good strat, such as: tilting bait units of gnoblars?

The bull charge is simply gravy for an ogre army. Its a nice bonus, but never spend points improving it, as it's too easy for an opponent to deny it.

Kadrium can verify for me on this one. I tried every way in the world to "focus" on the Bull Charge when I started playing a little over a year ago. I tried the Super Charge Tyrant (Bull Gut, Wall Crusher, Bruiser w/ Dragon Hide Unit of 6 IGs and a Bullgorger spell) and though I will have to admit, when it goes off there is no greater amount of devastation to be reaped from one unit; but when it doesnt and that unit gets mowed down, you honestly feel like you want to throw up. Kadrium is totally dead on with this (I now know from experience), the Bull Charge is nice when it happens - thats it. Please dont focus on it as a complete strategy in and of itself.

I've found it quite usefull to field a mix of 3 man units combined with 4 man units plus heroes. one of the ogres in the 4 man units goes to the rear rank. This adds a strength bonus to the bull charge, but more importantly it gives me extra wounds before panic tests start kicking in....I have never had the pleasure of fielding a tyrant.

This strat does work really nice, and is a viable option. Though I find myself using this more in friendly games against shooters than tournaments. (Says the Cormorant after the most recent list he played... ) As far as the Tyrant goes, you are in for a treat my friend  . I love how afraid people are of his unit!

Can anyone now advise how many ogres in a unit to use against Bretonnians? ... Hey has anyone beaten Brets here? Know any good strat, such as: tilting bait units of gnoblars?

I play against Brets almost as often as I do Weed Elves. We have three Bret players in my location. The most absolute and total piece of worthwhile advice I think I can offer is - for love of whatever deity you worship, do NOT let them charge you. They will break you 99% of the time, run you down, and kill you. Period. If you are feeling froggy and think they will not kill them all on the charge, you can let a unit of TC Bulls get charged and rely on Stubborn to keep you there so you can hit the flanks - but this is very very risky.

Piece of advice number two: Never rely on Gnoblars for anything against any army. Many a great battle plan of mine has failed in thinking those little green turds would do their job, and one bicker later...I'm picking ogres up off the table. The only strat they excel at is Table Quarter Capture - because you dont move them or fight with them to do it! Gnobbie are kind of like Bull Charges, they are nice when they do what they are supposed to do. Of course, my Gnobbies bicker more than most I think. Maybe I should get them some anger management... Seriously, against Brets, use Gnobbies to either draw Trebuche fire or threaten the Men at Arms units and keep them busy while your boys are killing knights somewhere.

Anyhoo, dont be afraid of the Blessing of the Lady. Let them let you go first. This gives you the opportunity to lure them into the positions you want them to be in. Send your bulls up as normal, but not as far, and tilt the IGs and get them ready to slam the flanks. Keep in mind that Brets charge our distance + 1/2 (18"), so you wont have to go your full distance all the time to get them to come out and be hit by IGs. If you do go your full distance, they can run those units down, and hit the guys that were supposed to hit them next turn! If you get flank charges on these guys, they break pretty easily.

The best spells (IMHO) against them are: Bullgorger (on the IG units - it practically negates their basic AS. If you can get this one on a unit of IGs with a Bruiser/Tyrant equipped with Siegebreaker - they become a knight slaughtering machine because he does completely negate their basic AS! (str9!)); Bonecruncher (of course!); and Trollguts (if you do get charged or think you might, it can save a lot of wounds).

The Hunter can wreak some serious havoc on them as well because the Bolt Thrower part negates AS and can hit their ranks - most Knights are only T3, so you can probably wound all three knights in the rank. You can also use your Cav Kitties to do some character hunting and baiting - they move just as fast as they do with the bonus that you are Fast Cav.

So just watch for moving to far, and never let them go first. If they go first, they wont move far enough for you to charge, but they will almost be able to choose who they want to hit next turn.

Hope this helps!