Crucible IV - Orlando GT - 2500 - no comp

Thought I'd post my list going into Crucible IV.  Seems pretty vanilla but who knows?  Maybe I missed something.  Please see the alternatives below the list.  Take a look!

LORDS
Slaughtermaster
- Great weapon
- Level 4, Lore of the Great Maw
- Crown of Command, Dispel Scroll, Armour of Fortune

HEROES
Bruiser
- Battle standard bearer, heavy armour, ironfist
- Runemaw

Firebelly
- Additional hand weapon
- Level 1, Lore of Fire
- Hellheart

CORE
12 Ironguts
- Full command
- Standard of Discipline

10 Gnoblars
- Standard bearer

10 Gnoblars
- Standard bearer

SPECIAL
8 Leadbelchers
- Bellower

4 Mournfang Cavalry
- Heavy armour, ironfists
- Bellower, standard bearer
- Dargonhide Banner

1 Sabretusk Pack

1 Sabretusk Pack

1 Sabretusk Pack

RARE
Ironblaster

Ironblaster


The Gnoblars are there to help with special scenarios that use banners.

The alternatives I'm considering are:

- Tank up the BSB instead of Runemaw.  On the fence here but the competition is going to be dirty.  Lots of spells that it can stop in this meta, I believe.

- Swap Firebelly with Butcher for Maw tax and take Heavens on the SM.  Leaves SM a little vulnerable but adds so much ranged threat.

- Swap Leadbelchers with 6 Pistol-eaters.  I like the durability and added firepower of the Leadies.

Thanks for reading.  Comments welcome!

Its a good list and i will be honest i like all three of your options. That is because it then bears very similar resemblance to my no comp list

Solid looking list.  Couple of concerns though:

1- if you run your Guts 4 wide it will force a character forward, and once the champ dies it will force 2 forward.  None are really able to soak up wounds throughout the game except for the SM but if you send either of the other two it will cause your BSB to get engaged and killed.  I would probably change the kit on the SM to Fencers/Glittering Scales then either a DS or a 5++.  He dhould take a lot less damage that way.  I would possibly look into getting points for another bruiser with GW and CoC to sit in the second rank.

2- i would split up the Leadbelchers into two groups of 4

3- do not get rid of the Runemaw, I would drop the DS or HH before that in an uncomped event.

I actually really like this list so I don't have much to point out.

First of all in the FAQ they've said they don't like you taking armour on your SM saying it is "against the
spirit" of the rules, so you might lose yourself some sportsmanship points there.

Then second of all, I feel like your two blocks of Gnoblars aren't doing too much, they could be replaced by one block with Trappers for Dangerous Terrain rules, or two Sabertusks (which should let you take a champion for your Leadbelchers).

I think swapping out the leadbelchers for maneaters can be a good idea. You want to hit fast and hard with the gutstar and mournfangs and altho the leads can soften blocks up you are bound to be in cc at round 2 wich means no shooting for leads. (I think 8 is  big investment).

Thanks for the feedback, fellas.

@Minigiant Yea I know that's what I've been tossing around in my head.  They're all such great options!  Hopefully I get an epiphany or break though during a test game.

@Tyrant Grix I run the star either 3 wide or 4 depending on what I'm facing.  If I have to out grind - I go 3, pushing 1 character forward at a time.  If I have out kill or am not afraid of a prolonged combat, I go 4 and probably put all characters forward to force allocation. 

I can't lose CoC and paying for a separate character seems really wasteful.  Have you done that or seen that run?  Some folks run it on the BSB but that would toss the Runemaw (which I'd do before taking a 2nd Bruiser).  That's another alternative though, thanks!

The debate on 1x8 or 2x4 is tricky and is list dependent.  What about this list makes you think 2x4 is better?  I think better points denial and threat presence is better in this case.  2x4 I think is better suited to an MMU (something I haven't run in a long time). 

@Ambush This is an uncomped event.  No one is going to care.  No sports score either.  Do folks you play with seriously give you heat about this?

The two Gnoblar blocks are for the event scenarios and dummy drops.  Otherwise I'd just have more IG or an Ogre dart.

@Northvoice That's true.  The versatility is often the reason MEs are taken.  The point of the LBs isn't to soften blocks, it's to kill chaff, pick up stray points (like lone fleeing models and what-not), then if nothing else, to soften blocks.  Softening blocks makes them sound like a laxative haha. 

I disagree that my list is supposed to hit hard and fast in CC.  It actually has a lot of ranged firepower and I tend to move slowly into positions that are favorable rather than charging ahead.  Also given that I have 2 CC blocks not counting the LBs, most other armies have more so there is likely always something to shoot at.  Or so I have found to be my experience.

Also, 8 seems to be a good number because I don't really know where else the points could effectively go.  Level 2 on the FB and champion for MFC?  How do you usually run your LBs?  How do you run your MEs?

I run maneaters 6-8 strong with stubborn and swiftstride. I tried 8 leadbelchers but it was to attraktive target for spells like foot of gorok. So now i use 6 or 4.

I interpretated your list wrong then :-). If you drop 3 leads you can almost get a unit of 2 mfc that works as support and chafclear/redirector and hunt fleeing units. But i got like 40 games under my belt so im no pro what so ever. I just now got the final list for my ogres that i will use for tournament.

(Sorry for terrible spelling).

+++ Ogre stronghold (2499pts) +++

++ Ogre Kindoms - Army Book (2013-4) -V8.8.1. (End Times) ++



+ Lords +

Slaughtermaster [Great Weapon (FAQed), Lore of the Great Maw, Wizard Level 4]
Magic Items [BRB - Dispel Scroll, BRB - Ironcurse Icon, BRB - Obsidian Lodestone]

+ Heroes +

Bruiser [Battle Standard Bearer, Great Weapon,
Magic Items and Big Names [BRB - Armour of Destiny]

Firebelly [Great Weapon, Lore of Fire, Wizard Level 1]
Magic Items [AB - Hellheart]

+ Core +

Gnoblars [10x Gnoblars, Standard Bearer]

Gnoblars [10x Gnoblars, Standard Bearer]

Ironguts [Bellower, Champion, 12x Ironguts]
Standard Bearer [BRB - Standard of Discipline]

+ Rare +

Ironblaster [Crew]

Ironblaster [Crew]

+ Special +

Leadbelchers [Bellower, 5x Leadbelchers]

Mournfang Cavalry [Bellower, Mournfang]
4x Ogre [4x Heavy Armour, 4x Ironfists]
Standard Bearer [AB - Dragonhide Banner]

Mournfang Cavalry [Bellower, Mournfang]
2x Ogre [2x Heavy Armour, 2x Ironfists]

Sabretusk

Sabretusk

Sabertusk

Heres a suggestion, idea is the MR 3 will be equally or more effective then runemaw. Im guessing you wherent planning on pulling the sm into combat. This opens upp for the bruiser to become a massive tank and challange soaker. But again im new and i just thinking out loud.

That's why I posted: to get feedback like yours, Northvoice.

The logic that 8 leadbelchers which cost around 350 is more of a target than 6-8 maneaters which cost between 380 - 500 points with BoP doesn't jive with me.  Leadbelchers are more durable per point.  I'd much rather my LBs get Footed than MEs...  Am I missing something?

On your list; you'd trade CoC, Runemaw, and a ward save on the SM for that set up?  I'd love to have some MR, honestly.  I just can't rationalize trading any of the gear currently equipped for it.  Also, MR is not the same as Runemaw when you get Dwellered or Pitted...  Not by a long shot.

But tanking up the BSB was one of my alternatives to the Runemaw... You'd say no without MR to replace?

Interesting thought on the small MFC pack.  If I had more I'd test it out.  They seem to be the favorite of some around here.  Must be pretty effective.

Heh well i was comparing 8 leads to 6 leads. That 6 would do enogh dmg but not get the unwanted attention. I dont run them 4 cause they are easy to cause panic in.

I have never used runemaw in any game cause i always tank up my bsb. I have not used crown of command either but thats mostly cause its comped for ogres.

Im trying a sm with gruts sickle and MR3 in a week. But then i have a tanked bsb and tanked tyrant :-).

If you feel gutsy, try the gnoblar thives stone on the sm. Get MR2 and chans for ward. Last fight i stole my opponents +4 ward on his bsb. :-)

I think its a great list, the only things I'd change is kit out the SM with glittering scales and fencers blades and I'd drop the leadies for another unit of 4 mournfang. I think someone mentioned you be getting is combat pretty quick and you targets for shooting will deminish pretty quickly. But then I do have an unhealthy obsession with mournfang so I might be bias just a tad

To backup the point for taking Maneaters, the build I originally saw on the forums is this:

 Maneaters x6
-Bellower
-Standard
-Gleaming Pennant
-Scout
-Poison
-Brace of Pistols
-Heavy Armor

And it comes it at 420 points.

What you'll be sacrificing for this is your Leadbelchers and your MFC will instead be two blocks of two.

I think this change is alright, breaking up the MFC should be quite helpful, the change gives you 4 blocks of Infantry that can charge your opponent down, which makes your charges much harder to avoid while giving you more flanking options.

Of course the downside of not having Leadbelchers sucks, since your shooting is significantly worse, however the two cannons should definitely survive long enough to do damage, since the Maneaters will harass any Warmachines your opponent has.

A quick note I wanted to add was, don't consider for a second dropping Runemaw if you are running Guts, since it will be 100% needed in no comp.

Thought I'd give a follow-up on this list and it's performance.

There was some fierce competition at Crucible 4 and some of the filth that came out of the woodwork was unbelievable.

Round 1: Daniel Furbush - High Elves - 3/13 loss
Round 2:  Nafi Mohammad - Warriors of Chaos - 14/1 win
Round 3: Chris Platt - Dark Elves - 14/1 win
Round 4:  Grady Sonam - Wood Elves - 11/4 win
Round 5:  Josh Bradford - High Elves - 15/3 win

So that's 57 out of 75 and enough for Best General!  Daniel Furbush took 1st overall, crushing all before him.  This is my first award at a major event.

Overview:
- Ironblasters - There's no alternative.  They were key to every game.  Double up, always and forever <3
- Gutbus - Only died to P-sun, otherwise never gave up any of it's points.  Able to out-grind most anything.
- Slaughtermaster - How else do I get Trollguts?  Oh, CoC is a must take.  So is the Scroll.
- BSB - Runemaw paid off.  "You only have to worry about P-sun," they said.  I wouldn't leave home without it anymore if running the Gutbus.
- Firebelly - Crappy.  I mean, Hellheart is great but he didn't do anything else.  Ever.  Just chucked out some Fireballs if I had spare dice.  I might take a Beast Butcher or something.  Then again, no one else had regen so...  Who knows.  He seems more and more situational.  Whereas Wyssans is always awesome.  Oh and HH didn't do anything spectacular, just shut down phases when I needed it to.
- Sabretusks - Useful to kite CC threats and keep enemy chaff busy.  Little risk, tons of reward.  Always 3.
- Leadbelchers - They have so much zone control, people absolutely fear them more than is warranted.  I wouldn't have traded for MEs.  You'd lose so much fire power and durability.  Number is perfect, might trade 1 to buy a wizard level on the HH caddy.
- Mournfang - Eh.  Needed 2 CC threats.  They did what I wanted.  They tear it up if they get there.  Wouldn't reduce the size.
- Gnoblars - Effective screens, actually.  Usually did nothing but waste time and provide comic relief. 

A more detailed bat rep is in the works. 

Congrats!  Always great to see Ogre's do well in a GT.  I for one am looking forward to the reports, cant wait.

Good job! Adding runemaw and leadbelchers to all my lists. :-)

The following is a tournament write up with highlights from each of my games at Crucible 4.  I may add detailed battle reports later if I find the time but I doubt I will during the season.  Maybe in May but then it’s time for Nashcon…

Game 1: 
Daniel Furbush, High Elves

The List:  Teclis, Eltharion the Grim (Light?), Lv2 Mage (Light), Noble BSB, Lv1 Mage (High), 30 Archers, 3x5 Reavers, 20ish PG w/BotWD, 4 RBTs.  I didn’t really look at his list: it was on an iPad.

Terrain:  The terrain was a little excessive on this table.  A massive ~9 inch diameter, 1 foot tall, impassible feature was dead center, and two giant hills were on each flank.  An ordinary forest sat in each deployment zone.  My right hill was also a freakin’ Bane Stone giving +1 to wound against all models within 6 inches.  Pretty much half of the board was inaccessible for me.

Deployment:  Predictably so, Dan deployed to capitalize on that Bane Stone, forcing me to come around the massive center piece.  I had no choice but to deploy accordingly.  Nothing special about deployment but it was clear this was a game I’d have to go and catch my dinner. 

Highlights:  Ogres go first and push forward.  A cannon strikes true on Teclis who fails his LoS but passes a 5+ ward save.  Damn!  Teclis gets pissed and uses his item that generates dice on each cast, forcing my scroll.  I eat a Sun later on my way to his PG bunker and the MFC decide to fail a charge having only needed a 5.   So what’s left of the Guts go in alone.  We start duking it out while the MFC spectate.  Dan chucks out a 3 dice Sun and gets IF… It miscasts but scatters on to me anyway, eating everyone but the Firebelly who I just take off in combat.  Either as a result of that or a HH use, Teclis fails his Throne buff and suffers a miscast but uses his item to ignore it.  So close!  MFC get panicked by an RBT and fail 2 more rally checks to run off the board.  So I get tabled and killed next to nothing, weeeeee.  It was looking okay until that second Sun.  3/13 loss.  Best game I’ve played in a while.

Game 2:
Nafi Muhammad, Warriors of Chaos

The List:  Nurgle Lord on palanquin in a unit of 20ish Nurgle Warriors w/shields, Lv2 Nurgle Sorcerer on steed with 6 or 7 knights, BSB with 20ish Nurgle warriors w/halberds, 2 Hellcannons, a Gorebeast chariot and 2 packs of hounds.

Terrain: A building and a piece of impassible divided the table in 3 lanes, center and flanks.  A forest was a in each deployment but pretty sparse.

Deployment:  I set up my chaff to delay the knights and my Guts and MFC to take out the warriors.  He deployed mostly centrally with Hellcannons on each flank and the Gorebeast to my right.

Highlights:  Warriors take the first turn and haul ass toward me.  I sit tight, chaff the knights, and wait.  Ironblaster takes out the Lord on the Palanquin, sorry but he asked for it.  He declares 2 long charges against me and fails them both, moving ever closer.  Hellcannons are hitting dead on against my guts, killing 2 or 3 a turn.  My turn I get a charge to each warrior unit and wiped em out.  He was a little surprised.  A Hellcannon implodes on turn 3.  I chaffed his knights until turn 5 when they had 3 left and finally saw combat only to get Gut flanked.  14/1 win.

Game 3:
Chris Platt, Dark Elves

The List:  Crone on a CoB and a Death Hag BSB in a unit of 30-40 witch elves.  Level 4 Dark sorcerer with 20 or so Dark Shards, 5 Dark Riders, 5 Warlocks, a Hydra, and 25ish Black Guard.

Terrain:  An Altar of Khaine sat in his deployment zone that we counted as a hill.  Then a bunch of random impassible rocks, pretty light.

Deployment:  I waited for the Cauldron drop and deployed everything away from it. 

Highlights: Chris was a kind fellow and pushed his Blackguard within 15” of the MFC who gladly make the charge and slaughter them.  He admitted to gravely underestimating the MFC.  Also on turn 1, I mash Crone with a cannonball but the CoB endures.  MFC reform to charge the Darkshards, butchering them.  I chaff the witches until I was ready then I descended and broke them.  14/1 win.

That night:
We started the drinking right after round 3 and came back to the Game Hall around… I don’t even know when to throw down a team game.  We were smashed… I was “casting Fireballs” on myself with shots of Fireball Whiskey all night.  The game used our tournament lists in a 2v2 2500 points per side match on a single 6x4 table.  It was so jam packed.  No one knew what the hell was going on.  My team mate was VC.  I had my LBs in a Pyramid shooting some Khorne warriors the whole time.  I charge my Gutbus into some Warlocks that they were too aggressive with.  My Gutbus the got surrounded after the overrun but fought its way through 25ish Khorne Halberd warriors, an exalted champ who turned into a Deamon Prince and charge my flank, a Warshrine, 5 Khorne Knights from the other flank.  Oh yea.  It was mayhem.  Another buddy had torn his Achilles heel a month ago and had this little…scooter thing that you put your knee on and skate around.  So someone got on it and pretended to be a Pump Wagon, making fun of the fact that the VC player had lost his last match to one.  Pump Harder!  He crashed into the tables and fell over...  That night I dreamt of conquest.

Game 4:
Grady Sonam, Wood Elves

The List:  Deer council with 2 Lv4s and BSB.  2 units of 12 Waywatchers, 2 units of 7 Wild Riders, 2 units of 10 Trueflight Gladeguard, an Eagle, 20 Eternal Guard. 

Terrain:  There was a tower in my corner but it was otherwise exceptionally sparse and light on impassible features.

Deployment:  I deployed in the corner.  Haven’t you heard of the Ogre Castle?   He was spread out.

Highlights:  Luckily perhaps that Grady was with us the night before and partook in our festivities so I wasn’t the only one hung over.  By turn 3 I’d killed both Lv4s and BSB by LB and IB fire.  I got some wild Riders to charge my Gutbus.  Other than that it was a pretty uneventful game.  He made some mistakes that I punished him for.  We traded a few punches.  This seemed the most effective way to combat so much avoidance.  11/4 win

Game 5:
Josh Bradford, High Elves

The List:Alarielle, a mage, and a BSB all in about 28 or so White Lions with BotWD.  A Lv4 in 21 or so Archers.  4 RBTS, 7 Sisters, 2 packs of 6 Reavers, a pack of 6 Silverhelms, and a unit of scouting dudes.

Terrain: The left part of the table was a little crowded with impassible terrain while the right was wide open.

Deployment: He started on the table edge, pretty centrally.  I started on the line, chomping at the bit, favoring the open left flank.

Highlights: I played the most aggressively I ever have.  Before the game I taunted Josh, saying he didn’t played aggressive enough.  It worked!  He came at me!  I was able to out-grind the Whitelions and eventually killed them.  Most of the game revolved around that.  A critical HH use shutdown an otherwise potentially devastating magic phase that I think he was relying on when he charged in.  Otherwise he didn’t kill anything except chaff and an IB in the last turn (I had 2 Guts left but no points given, so close).  It wasn’t easy by any means but there isn’t much to say.  He engaged me quickly; there wasn’t any maneuvering or fancy footwork.  Just a straight duke-out for 3 turns that I prevailed in.  I was able to get Trollguts or Toothcracker and stop Flesh to Stone.  Someone “cast a Fireball” on my turn 5 and I happily obliged.  15/1 win. 

Overall:  An amazing weekend and tons of fun.  Learned a lot.  The soft scores were a little arcane and wonky so I placed second for battle points getting Best General but tied like, 3 people for 4th place overall?  I think there were 32ish people at the event.  I was the only Ogre!