22 Jul 2014
So, in a moment of drunken euphoria I offered to play any army that my pal from LD2 (San Fran Warhammer club and arguably the best players on the West Coast) put in front of me for the tournament, with no prior knowledge of what it was. As it turns out, it was Ogres. I also took a challenge to randomly roll my magic lore on my top wizard, but that came up heavens which is what I would have chosen for mine, anyhow. While I do have a good familiarity of Ogres, this list was something I had never played before:
SM w Lore of Heavens L4, Tormenter Blade, 5+ Ward, Charmed Shield, Power Stone, Stubborn Crown
BSB w Talisman of Preservation, and the other 5 point magic weapon
Butcher w GW, L2 Maw Lore, Scroll, Ruby Ring
12 Ironguts with FC and Std of Disc
11 Bulls w FC and AHW
8 Maneaters with FC, Brace, Scout, Poison
3 x Solo Saber
2 x Gorger
Now, I have not played a true deathstar army in like five years. I had no real clue how to play this list and the fact that it got judge comped so low (5 out of 15 against an average score of around 7.6) meant someone knew something about it that I didn't. Poison Pistoleaters and Lore of Heavens I knew well enough, so I had some ray of hope in this event. But the giant point denial blocks are just not something I am really into, especially with three characters who were not honestly any good in a fight. Anyhow some short synopsis follows of my games, as well as I can recall in my drunken state:
Game 1 vs Great Wall of Nurgle (Papa, 2 PB blocks one massive, one medium, 3 solo beasts, some furies, 4 flys, and a Khannon)
Not a great matchup for me and the game began with my general exploding after casting boosted comet. The upside was that this was take the hill for objectives and the comet was placed just beyond his side of the hill. Knowing I had no prayer of winning at this point, I focused on bonus objectives. The comet and gorgers managed to keep his units off of the hill (the comet got to 14 counters before it fell) and the maneaters rolled enough of his flank that he went after them instead of the bonus points. Ultimately, I lost but netted all of the bonus, so I felt like I could make this army work for me.
Game 2 vs infantry VC led by blender lord
There is not much to say about this game, tactically. I stalled his main unit with dogs and picked off all of the surrounding units before mass rushing the vampire lord bunker. Judicious use of Lore of Heavens and selective shooting with the Maneaters let me neutralize every real threat early. The round I pounded his Graveguard bunker with the Lord in it was a combat that I ended up winning by 22 (!), so crumblerooskie for the vamp lord. Easy full win for me.
Game 3 vs Great Wall of Nurgle (Matt from the Chupacabras)
This list had a more MMU feel to it, with two four packs of beasts and even sized blocks and a soul grinder. I have played (and beaten) Matt before and he took my advice in adjusting his list to make it more comp friendly and just better in general. Unfortunately, Curse of the Midnight Wind killed his poison rolls so bad that I was able to demolish his army fairly soundly. Papa, himself, was ultimately done in by a flank charge from Maneaters. Matt is new, but learning pretty quickly and I think I was his only loss on the weekend.
So day one ends (but not the drunken shenanigans) and I feel like I am doing ok. With two wins, I am a point behind my wife in battle (she brought her usual Nurgle Daemon army) and had played three really good guys with reasonable but tough armies. Thus far, my lack of knowledge of the army had not hurt me too badly, but I was having difficulty getting the gutstar or gorgers to do anything useful. Day two arrives....
Game 4 vs Softy Dragon High Elves (Dragon Lord, Fire Dragon Mage, Knights, Reavers, Eagles, BTs, Phoenix)
This was a modified Blood And Glory where the first army to break coughed up 300 VPs. Unfortunately, I did not realize until around turn four that my opponent's army was autobroken at the start of the game. If I had, I could have put my entire army in one corner and lobbed Comet and Thunderbolt at him all game. Instead, I made a play for the center of the board, stationing the Maneaters in a building there. I used comets to discourage him approaching me, all the while drilling his dragon lord with magic missiles and pistol fire. Turn four, the wheels came off. We figured out he had autobroken, giving me 300 points and he suddenly decided to combo charge my one bull unit with everything he had. I had commited to moving forward, not realizing I had the game won, and topped off my failure with a dismal magic phase leading into that round. So, the end result was my entire bull block and butcher being gibbed in one round. The other depressing part of this game was that despite six full rounds of my maneaters blasting nothing but his general (and several Thunderbolts tossed in for good measure) he made so many saves that I did not manage to pop his general or the dragon he was riding. I think at one point his lord made nine consecutive ward saves or something, not to mention tons of 5s the dragon rolled. Oh well, the real error was not realizing he was broken and just castling in the first place. All my other screw ups followed from that. I was able to massage some bonus points out of the loss, so it was not that bad points wise, but my wife was now well ahead of me in battle, having won a bloodbath against a Brett Flying Circus army.
Game 5- Col. Sanders w OK (Gutstar, Cannon, Leadie unit, MFC, trio of maneater scouts, some gnobs and cats)
So, Sanders is a good guy and great general and he actually knew and practiced with his army. He also had the Hellheart, so hoping for magic to reel in the slack was not an option. Not an easy game. So, my basic plan is what it always is when facing deathstars. Snipe the small support units and swarm charge the big unit at the end. The issue here was the army I was using could not outmaneuver the MFC and my shooting was not really hurting them. I took out the mini Maneater unit and Cannon early and set up a trap in the center to get the MFC alone.
The plan was this: My general's unit has a cat 7 inches behind it and is in medium charge range for both his gutstar and his MFC. There is a Comet in the air ready to land on both units. My Bull unit is in a good position to counter charge the MFC on the flank and my Maneaters are set to hit them in the rear. I have a Gorger set in back to make sure they flee so far away that they might not make it back into the game if he choses to flee a counter charge with the MFC. So, the plan is flee the general's unit and pass through the cat and get away, following up with counter charges. What happens instead is that I roll a five for my flee, falling short of the cat. Now I am still too far for the Gutstar to get home on the charge. The MFC are still within 20 inches, however, and Col. Sanders rolls box cars for his charge like a boss. I look at the table and offer to play out the game or concede at his discretion. Sanders opts to pack up early and I give him my congratulations, along with my favorite opponent vote.
Lessons Learned:
The experiment of using an unfamiliar army at a GT was actually a fun one, but not one I will be repeating again this year. Ultimately, my unfamiliarity with my army cost me at least one game, as I was focusing on my own army instead of sizing up the fortitude of the High Elven army game four. It probably also made me much more conservative in other games, resulting in losses or at least less clean play. But I did learn some things that I will take away from this experience and I have zero regrets.
1) Scout/Poison is damn near as good as Stubborn/Poison-
While I like to bunker characters in my own Maneaters, the ability to plop them down last and roll flanks really opened my eyes on the value of the Scout ability. Throughout the event, the Maneaters were the one consistent high performer in every game, dying only in the first game when the entire Nurgle went after them and they had no magical support. Scouting made people really conservative in their deployment.
2) Deathstar Armies need a couple combat characters-
I was perpetually leery of committing the gutstar to fights because my general and BSB were not effective combatants. My general, in fact, died in every game aside from the VC one, with two of those occasions being random S4 attacks piling on him. I am guessing the guy who lent me the army was scared of ethereal, but the casters really needed better ward saves and a great weapon to function as part of their units in combat. The Butcher had the GW and his unit did better than the Guts in general, as a result. As much as I love Lore of Heavens, there were numerous times where I would have killed to have a decked out combat Tyrant instead of a SM.
3) Power Stones are as good as the Gruts Sickle-
Generally speaking, once the enemy burns his scroll, you can reliably get one or two heavens spells off a turn against an equal level caster, mostly because nothing in the lore requires more than two dice to cast aside from Bubble Curse or Comet. So, for far less cost, you can pop the stone to pull an early scroll or force an early harmonic/comet past them. The power stone is also more comp friendly and carries no risk to have.
4) I suck at deathstars and the meta makes it worse-
Five years of never touching the style of play has left me completely inexperienced at playing super units, though I know how to take them down when facing them. The MMU/MSU intensive elf meta makes having few units (especially ones without ranged offense) a serious liability. I think when I get my lizards done, I am going to play some games with larger units just to get a better feel for their use. As it was, most of my biggest errors all weekend came from not knowing how and when to commit such obnoxiously large units to a fight.
So, the end result was my worst showing at this event, ever. In fact, I think that may have been my worst GT result of all time. But I played five excellent guys who were all worthy of a favorite opponent vote and ran reasonable armies, so I have no complaints or regrets. I pulled this stunt to challenge myself and learn, which is what I did. As always, Mike and the LD2 gang run a fun show and we all had a great time and it was, along with Waughpaca, one of the most drama free events I have ever been to. The wife had a good run, too, finishing 3-1-1 and in the top 1/3 of the running, though she was a bit pooped and crabby by the end due to lack of sleep and excessive drinking.
So, long story short, despite having done horribly, this was probably the most fun and relaxed time I have ever had at QCR in the 6-7 years I have been going.
SM w Lore of Heavens L4, Tormenter Blade, 5+ Ward, Charmed Shield, Power Stone, Stubborn Crown
BSB w Talisman of Preservation, and the other 5 point magic weapon
Butcher w GW, L2 Maw Lore, Scroll, Ruby Ring
12 Ironguts with FC and Std of Disc
11 Bulls w FC and AHW
8 Maneaters with FC, Brace, Scout, Poison
3 x Solo Saber
2 x Gorger
Now, I have not played a true deathstar army in like five years. I had no real clue how to play this list and the fact that it got judge comped so low (5 out of 15 against an average score of around 7.6) meant someone knew something about it that I didn't. Poison Pistoleaters and Lore of Heavens I knew well enough, so I had some ray of hope in this event. But the giant point denial blocks are just not something I am really into, especially with three characters who were not honestly any good in a fight. Anyhow some short synopsis follows of my games, as well as I can recall in my drunken state:
Game 1 vs Great Wall of Nurgle (Papa, 2 PB blocks one massive, one medium, 3 solo beasts, some furies, 4 flys, and a Khannon)
Not a great matchup for me and the game began with my general exploding after casting boosted comet. The upside was that this was take the hill for objectives and the comet was placed just beyond his side of the hill. Knowing I had no prayer of winning at this point, I focused on bonus objectives. The comet and gorgers managed to keep his units off of the hill (the comet got to 14 counters before it fell) and the maneaters rolled enough of his flank that he went after them instead of the bonus points. Ultimately, I lost but netted all of the bonus, so I felt like I could make this army work for me.
Game 2 vs infantry VC led by blender lord
There is not much to say about this game, tactically. I stalled his main unit with dogs and picked off all of the surrounding units before mass rushing the vampire lord bunker. Judicious use of Lore of Heavens and selective shooting with the Maneaters let me neutralize every real threat early. The round I pounded his Graveguard bunker with the Lord in it was a combat that I ended up winning by 22 (!), so crumblerooskie for the vamp lord. Easy full win for me.
Game 3 vs Great Wall of Nurgle (Matt from the Chupacabras)
This list had a more MMU feel to it, with two four packs of beasts and even sized blocks and a soul grinder. I have played (and beaten) Matt before and he took my advice in adjusting his list to make it more comp friendly and just better in general. Unfortunately, Curse of the Midnight Wind killed his poison rolls so bad that I was able to demolish his army fairly soundly. Papa, himself, was ultimately done in by a flank charge from Maneaters. Matt is new, but learning pretty quickly and I think I was his only loss on the weekend.
So day one ends (but not the drunken shenanigans) and I feel like I am doing ok. With two wins, I am a point behind my wife in battle (she brought her usual Nurgle Daemon army) and had played three really good guys with reasonable but tough armies. Thus far, my lack of knowledge of the army had not hurt me too badly, but I was having difficulty getting the gutstar or gorgers to do anything useful. Day two arrives....
Game 4 vs Softy Dragon High Elves (Dragon Lord, Fire Dragon Mage, Knights, Reavers, Eagles, BTs, Phoenix)
This was a modified Blood And Glory where the first army to break coughed up 300 VPs. Unfortunately, I did not realize until around turn four that my opponent's army was autobroken at the start of the game. If I had, I could have put my entire army in one corner and lobbed Comet and Thunderbolt at him all game. Instead, I made a play for the center of the board, stationing the Maneaters in a building there. I used comets to discourage him approaching me, all the while drilling his dragon lord with magic missiles and pistol fire. Turn four, the wheels came off. We figured out he had autobroken, giving me 300 points and he suddenly decided to combo charge my one bull unit with everything he had. I had commited to moving forward, not realizing I had the game won, and topped off my failure with a dismal magic phase leading into that round. So, the end result was my entire bull block and butcher being gibbed in one round. The other depressing part of this game was that despite six full rounds of my maneaters blasting nothing but his general (and several Thunderbolts tossed in for good measure) he made so many saves that I did not manage to pop his general or the dragon he was riding. I think at one point his lord made nine consecutive ward saves or something, not to mention tons of 5s the dragon rolled. Oh well, the real error was not realizing he was broken and just castling in the first place. All my other screw ups followed from that. I was able to massage some bonus points out of the loss, so it was not that bad points wise, but my wife was now well ahead of me in battle, having won a bloodbath against a Brett Flying Circus army.
Game 5- Col. Sanders w OK (Gutstar, Cannon, Leadie unit, MFC, trio of maneater scouts, some gnobs and cats)
So, Sanders is a good guy and great general and he actually knew and practiced with his army. He also had the Hellheart, so hoping for magic to reel in the slack was not an option. Not an easy game. So, my basic plan is what it always is when facing deathstars. Snipe the small support units and swarm charge the big unit at the end. The issue here was the army I was using could not outmaneuver the MFC and my shooting was not really hurting them. I took out the mini Maneater unit and Cannon early and set up a trap in the center to get the MFC alone.
The plan was this: My general's unit has a cat 7 inches behind it and is in medium charge range for both his gutstar and his MFC. There is a Comet in the air ready to land on both units. My Bull unit is in a good position to counter charge the MFC on the flank and my Maneaters are set to hit them in the rear. I have a Gorger set in back to make sure they flee so far away that they might not make it back into the game if he choses to flee a counter charge with the MFC. So, the plan is flee the general's unit and pass through the cat and get away, following up with counter charges. What happens instead is that I roll a five for my flee, falling short of the cat. Now I am still too far for the Gutstar to get home on the charge. The MFC are still within 20 inches, however, and Col. Sanders rolls box cars for his charge like a boss. I look at the table and offer to play out the game or concede at his discretion. Sanders opts to pack up early and I give him my congratulations, along with my favorite opponent vote.
Lessons Learned:
The experiment of using an unfamiliar army at a GT was actually a fun one, but not one I will be repeating again this year. Ultimately, my unfamiliarity with my army cost me at least one game, as I was focusing on my own army instead of sizing up the fortitude of the High Elven army game four. It probably also made me much more conservative in other games, resulting in losses or at least less clean play. But I did learn some things that I will take away from this experience and I have zero regrets.
1) Scout/Poison is damn near as good as Stubborn/Poison-
While I like to bunker characters in my own Maneaters, the ability to plop them down last and roll flanks really opened my eyes on the value of the Scout ability. Throughout the event, the Maneaters were the one consistent high performer in every game, dying only in the first game when the entire Nurgle went after them and they had no magical support. Scouting made people really conservative in their deployment.
2) Deathstar Armies need a couple combat characters-
I was perpetually leery of committing the gutstar to fights because my general and BSB were not effective combatants. My general, in fact, died in every game aside from the VC one, with two of those occasions being random S4 attacks piling on him. I am guessing the guy who lent me the army was scared of ethereal, but the casters really needed better ward saves and a great weapon to function as part of their units in combat. The Butcher had the GW and his unit did better than the Guts in general, as a result. As much as I love Lore of Heavens, there were numerous times where I would have killed to have a decked out combat Tyrant instead of a SM.
3) Power Stones are as good as the Gruts Sickle-
Generally speaking, once the enemy burns his scroll, you can reliably get one or two heavens spells off a turn against an equal level caster, mostly because nothing in the lore requires more than two dice to cast aside from Bubble Curse or Comet. So, for far less cost, you can pop the stone to pull an early scroll or force an early harmonic/comet past them. The power stone is also more comp friendly and carries no risk to have.
4) I suck at deathstars and the meta makes it worse-
Five years of never touching the style of play has left me completely inexperienced at playing super units, though I know how to take them down when facing them. The MMU/MSU intensive elf meta makes having few units (especially ones without ranged offense) a serious liability. I think when I get my lizards done, I am going to play some games with larger units just to get a better feel for their use. As it was, most of my biggest errors all weekend came from not knowing how and when to commit such obnoxiously large units to a fight.
So, the end result was my worst showing at this event, ever. In fact, I think that may have been my worst GT result of all time. But I played five excellent guys who were all worthy of a favorite opponent vote and ran reasonable armies, so I have no complaints or regrets. I pulled this stunt to challenge myself and learn, which is what I did. As always, Mike and the LD2 gang run a fun show and we all had a great time and it was, along with Waughpaca, one of the most drama free events I have ever been to. The wife had a good run, too, finishing 3-1-1 and in the top 1/3 of the running, though she was a bit pooped and crabby by the end due to lack of sleep and excessive drinking.
So, long story short, despite having done horribly, this was probably the most fun and relaxed time I have ever had at QCR in the 6-7 years I have been going.
668 The Neighbor of the Beast