The first and largest home of the Ogre Kingdoms — preserved.
Filter by date range
Standalone from the search box above — this queries Pagefind
directly and checks each result's date itself, since the packaged search
widget can only match a single exact date, not a range.
so i recently, on a whim, bought the new daemons book. looking through it i realized that much like the 40k version they are leaning towards mono-god lists.
i like the way alot of the book runs and have found a couple of interesting ways to run things but i feel that under 2k the list is very sub par.
what do you guys think?
PaperBob11 Mar 2013
Haven't read through the book personally, but I AM a fan of the mono-god lists as far as fluff is concerned. With the chaotic nature of the demons and the inherent hostility of most Chaos cults, it would seem to reason that only one kind would be pulled into the material realm.
just-josh11 Mar 2013
Haven't read through the book personally, but I AM a fan of the mono-god lists as far as fluff is concerned. With the chaotic nature of the demons and the inherent hostility of most Chaos cults, it would seem to reason that only one kind would be pulled into the material realm.
But it isn't necessarily always the case that they are pulled into the material realm, as much as it is them tearing their way into it.
In many instances, throughout the fluff surrounding the Daemons of chaos, it has been a full scale incursion into the Mortal realm, a veritable horde of Chaos, with Daemons of all Gods present.
I do like the idea of Mono-God lists, as it gives you the opportunity for a pleasingly thematic army, but I find that the weaknesses and strengths of the troops of each God are rather symbiotic.
I haven't had the chance to read the book yet, but I do think I will like it. My feelings about the uber-cheese 7th Ed book are well known, and I think I will miss it a little
JJ
Resident Smiley Spam Artist and Fastest Fingers in the Stronghold.
Raising the forum's smiley count, one post at a time, since 2008
Quote from: Shadowlord on Mar 11, 2013, 01:57:18 PM
After all, painting 100 night goblins is something you do in the morning just before you are off to work.
And I think you missed a 0 when you wrote 11 armies. The correct nr should be 110 armies I would think, based on your painting speed.
lostandconfused11 Mar 2013
Ya the mono-god stuff is nice but I do agree that by a fluff standard isn't very accurate. And even though there are drawbacks for not taking mono-god lists I can still see multi-god lists working well if used properly.
just-josh11 Mar 2013
Overall, have there been any major changes to the rules? I expect they have been nerfed a little, but anything major?
JJ
Resident Smiley Spam Artist and Fastest Fingers in the Stronghold.
Raising the forum's smiley count, one post at a time, since 2008
Quote from: Shadowlord on Mar 11, 2013, 01:57:18 PM
After all, painting 100 night goblins is something you do in the morning just before you are off to work.
And I think you missed a 0 when you wrote 11 armies. The correct nr should be 110 armies I would think, based on your painting speed.
lostandconfused11 Mar 2013
Ya couple things have been toned down. I won't type everything lout because I'm on my phone and that's a pain lol.
Khorne is no longer frenzied unless you pay for a herald with the specific locus. And on the charge they get +1 strength. They have 3 loci which each cost a different points value but do not stack.
Tzeentch gets re-roll 1s for wards and channeling. They also have 3 different loci.
Slaanesh is the same with armour piercing.
Nurgle is the -1 to hit in combat.
Rolling for winds of magic when playing daemons can be interesting. They have a table and based on what you roll something good , or bad, can happen. He had are fairly safe though cause they usually require a roll of a 6 on another single dice roll.
The individual lores are nice and the attribute for the lores is the same. They an all regain or add models to units when specific requirements are met.
Daemon if gifts are rolled for randomly and each table is a different amount of points. Tables are 0 to 6 and you can always drop to the zero which is a magical weapon of some kind and some point value.
Those are the main changes. I can go more in depth later.
Gutlord Inquisitor11 Mar 2013
Overall, have there been any major changes to the rules? I expect they have been nerfed a little, but anything major?
JJ
Probably one of the biggest set of changes to any armybook ever? (Or at least, since the previous version of Daemons changed the Hordes of Chaos daemons? )
Okay, maybe that's an exaggeration but not much. The stats of the individual units didn't change much but there was a huge swathe of changes to the army, particularly the gifts got a complete overhaul. The loci upgrades for the characters to pass to their units got changed to a three-tiered system and generally much more expensive.
The only pre-existing build to make it through the changes unchanged is the Epidemius build (take Epi and lots of Nurgle). The new book encourages mono-god but it isn't impossible to mix gods. There are a few no-brainer choices like the Sulk Cannon but overall there seem to be a variety of possibilities at this time.
lostandconfused12 Mar 2013
The changeling and karanak are now characters too. So they take up hero percentage.
just-josh12 Mar 2013
Have any of the Special Characters changed?
JJ
Resident Smiley Spam Artist and Fastest Fingers in the Stronghold.
Raising the forum's smiley count, one post at a time, since 2008
Quote from: Shadowlord on Mar 11, 2013, 01:57:18 PM
After all, painting 100 night goblins is something you do in the morning just before you are off to work.
And I think you missed a 0 when you wrote 11 armies. The correct nr should be 110 armies I would think, based on your painting speed.
Gutlord Inquisitor12 Mar 2013
Yeah.
Epidemius is just as nasty and probably the one you're most likely to see. He's MC though and unable to join units of MC for one reason or another so expect him to be cowering from cannons somewhere.
Masque is much more expensive and less potent, although she does have more of a range of tricks (she can reduce Ld, S or I by 1 point now but only in your turn).
Kairos has been taken down a peg or two but he's still pretty solid.
Skulltaker is pretty rubbish.
The unit SCs are now heroes. Not sure about the others, haven't really looked at them too closely and I don't see anyone on fire about them either.
just-josh12 Mar 2013
Is Kairos still able to take as many spells, and hand pick them?
JJ
Resident Smiley Spam Artist and Fastest Fingers in the Stronghold.
Raising the forum's smiley count, one post at a time, since 2008
Quote from: Shadowlord on Mar 11, 2013, 01:57:18 PM
After all, painting 100 night goblins is something you do in the morning just before you are off to work.
And I think you missed a 0 when you wrote 11 armies. The correct nr should be 110 armies I would think, based on your painting speed.
LatteOkapi12 Mar 2013
Yes, Kairos can still pick his spells, and he can change them every game so he becomes very flexible in a tournament (that allows him)
Game's the same, just got more fierce. ~ Slim Charles
lostandconfused12 Mar 2013
I think we will all keep seeing epi lists especially now that you can take soul grinders as a rare choice and mark them for nurgle and give them a mobile stone thrower. I can see kugath coming into play a bit more too even though he's still expensive as hell but has a stone thrower that ignores armour entirely and can also move. I can see people through in some cheap slaanesh fast cav or chariots to tear cannons and other war machines apart or at least just tie them up forever.
just-josh12 Mar 2013
Back in 7th Ed, when Daemons really did stink of pure cheese, I used to run a Ku'gath/Epidemius list, that was tonnes of fun, whilst not really being too OP. It had measurable success, but wasn't overly competitive. It would be great to still see this as a viable list, but with Soulgrinders thrown in, it could become a fairly solid army
JJ
Resident Smiley Spam Artist and Fastest Fingers in the Stronghold.
Raising the forum's smiley count, one post at a time, since 2008
Quote from: Shadowlord on Mar 11, 2013, 01:57:18 PM
After all, painting 100 night goblins is something you do in the morning just before you are off to work.
And I think you missed a 0 when you wrote 11 armies. The correct nr should be 110 armies I would think, based on your painting speed.
lostandconfused12 Mar 2013
I've always thought about running a list like that but never did. The new lore is pretty solid to and is really more about buffs and debuffs than anything else. You can up toughness. You can give regen. Stuff like that. It can help to fix that whole epi being mc. I think the soul grinders will make for a strong list as well because it helps handle ranks on larger units and also gives another large target with thunderstomp.
just-josh12 Mar 2013
Why does being MC hamper Epidemius?
Yeah, the Soulgrinder is great, and will really help dealing with ranks, and if nothing else will draw cannon and gun fire away from the rest of your army... Can you fit two of them in 2500 or under?
The Lore of Nurgle sounds pretty nice. I am sorely tempted to go and buy the book now
JJ
Resident Smiley Spam Artist and Fastest Fingers in the Stronghold.
Raising the forum's smiley count, one post at a time, since 2008
Quote from: Shadowlord on Mar 11, 2013, 01:57:18 PM
After all, painting 100 night goblins is something you do in the morning just before you are off to work.
And I think you missed a 0 when you wrote 11 armies. The correct nr should be 110 armies I would think, based on your painting speed.
Gutlord Inquisitor12 Mar 2013
His tally goes away if he dies and being a MC he can't look out sir in a unit of infantry.
lostandconfused12 Mar 2013
Ya that's one of he big downfalls with him now. I'm not actually sure if you can but I wouldn't e surprised if it would fit in 2500. That's what, 675 points of rare? So I think they will.
Noisy Assassin13 Mar 2013
Yeah, they'll fit there easily.
Moniker14 Mar 2013
Whats the deal with the skull cannon of khorne? Is it an actual straight up cannon, or what?
lostandconfused14 Mar 2013
its a mobile cannon. with flaming. it can potentially gain wounds back but you have to use impact hits to do it. and thats only if you cause unsaved wounds. and then for each of those you get to roll a dice and on a 4+ it gets a wound back.
so really its just a mobile cannon.
Gutlord Inquisitor14 Mar 2013
It's pretty much an ironblaster but swap the extra bounce roll for flaming.
There are a few other differences but nothing major.
Phazael14 Mar 2013
Well it is an amazingly strong chariot for the points, even if it did not have the cannon strapped on the back of it. This is especially true when compared to the other laughably bad chariots in the same book.
668 The Neighbor of the Beast
lostandconfused14 Mar 2013
Haha. Ya you got that right. I think the only thing they got right with the chariots is that at least if you out a character on one he can still give out his loci to nearby units. And that's about it.
Moniker20 Mar 2013
Fair enough. I saw in the White Dwarf battle report that it used the large template, but that was for 40k so I was curious.
Not a big deal for me, no Daemons in my local group. Yet... One of the lads is thinking of starting one up. Ah well.
Biadetic31 Mar 2013
I for one like the DoC book. I'm not a power gamer so I can appreciate that they are at least trying to make it a little fluffier. I like how unstable it can be and how the gods war with one another. I love the fact that units can just appear or enemy wizards can turn into Chaos guys
Sure some things may be over priced and under priced, but its done now, but I wouldn;t mind playing DoC
Opens a new GitHub Issue pre-filled with a link back here — sign in with GitHub to post. If someone already restarted this thread, please add to that issue instead of opening a second one.
)