Yhetee or Nhotee?

Fellow Ogres! Lend me your ears! No Grut, not literally. Ew.



I'm contemplating adding some form of speedy flanking unit to my list. Yhetees look fairly promising, they're cheap, fast, and can beat up ghosts. Always fun.


Now, I know a lot of people don't seem that keen on them, but I would like to know why, and what I should be using instead if so? I was wondering if Maneaters with the +1Movement banner and swiftstride would be better, but that involves sending a banner to maybe be easily captured (though I could just also have them be stubborn).
There's also Mournfangs, but they're expensive. Powerful, but I'm not known for passing armour saves - I once tried out a Chaos Warrior army and I was not really seeing the beauty of Chaos Armour at work...


I was thinking a nice little 2x2 block would be good. Assuming the opponent isn't packing fire - and to be honest I won't be hunting much that's got flaming attacks and anyone trying to use Lore of Fire means it's less likely I'll be seeing that stupid Lore of Life.


Wise investment, or absolute tragedy in the works?



(P.S. - I was also contemplating a Stonehorn, because I like running over things with Mammoths)

Well Yhetees aren't bad. The main issue is that there's just better picks that do the same thing.  If you know you are going to be seeing someone with a cheesed out ethereal list they can be good but other then that I am not a big fan.  The main problem with them is that everyone packs a flaming banner somewhere because flaming also removes regen.  You also don't get the ogre charge bonus witch removes some of their attacks.

For around the same points (6 more points I think) You get maneaters, who have a better statline and 2 abilities. If you are looking for a fast moving unit maneaters are overall better. You can pick swiftstride with them or scout or even both.  You are given the option for a magic banner also which is nice.

Mournfangs are one of our hardest hitting meanest models we can field. Even if you are worried about bad armor rolls a couple of these bad boys will clobber just about anything on the charge.

My opinion on the matter: Yhetees aren't bad. But they aren't very good either they are a very situational meta-game pick.

The problem with Yhettees is exactly as you say: for about the same points you can get a unit of maneaters with the +1M banner and Swiftstride. These are pretty much better in every way, with the added bonus of a second special rule.

The poor Yhettees only have one saving grace - their attacks are magical. This is only really helpful if you run into an etherial heavy VC list, but it can be a useful protection if you are light on magic weapons.

Against an ethereal-heavy VC army, Yhetees aren't good. They aren't even bad. They are so terrible it hurts.

Without going into too much detail, what Hexwraiths do to Yhetees cannot under any circumstances be called fair.

Well, what hexwraiths do to mournfang or maneaters isn't very fair either. At least if the yhettees can get into combat then they can do some damage.

Mournfangs get a save against the Hex Wraiths and arn't Flammable. MEs arn't flammable either.

Mournfangs get a save against the Hex Wraiths and arn't Flammable. MEs arn't flammable either.

This.  And also, Mournfangs and Maneaters aren't taken to be used against an Ethereal list, whereas some poor misguided souls are likely to say "Ooh, they have magic weapons!" and take a bunch of Yhetees against a VC player.  And then lose half of them each time the Hexwraiths ride over them.

Mournfangs get a save against the Hex Wraiths and arn't Flammable. MEs arn't flammable either.

I believe hexwraith attacks ignore armour saves. Forgot about flaming attacks, that does make them worse. Still, in this matchup I'd rather have a unit that can hurt them but is vulnerable than one that can just die. Yhettees also help against the wall-o-wraiths or spirit hosts, etc.

Hey, I don't take Yhettees either and I'm not saying it suddenly makes them competitive but it's the only matchup I can think of that they might have an advantage over +1M swiftstride maneaters.

Just remove flammable and you'd actually see them from time to time. 

That or make their aura -1 to hit and apply to an entire combat . 

That won't happen though.  Alas the Yhetee will remain shelved.  Why GW?  Why?

The Hexwraith attacks are just Str5 flammable. Which is just about as bad as it gets for Yhetees.

Mournfangs get a 4+ save against the Hex Wraiths and don't care about flaming.

Just remove flammable and you'd actually see them from time to time. 

That or make their aura -1 to hit and apply to an entire combat . 

That won't happen though.  Alas the Yhetee will remain shelved.  Why GW?  Why?

Ah man its not even that good for Yhetees.

Instead of -1 to hit, its -1 to Weapon Skill which is about 25% as good! lol

**Oh I misread what you said. Making it -1 to hit instead of -1 to weapon skill would make it better. Yep for sure. The current aura does last all combat as well though. If they werent flammable, and had -1 to hit, I'd add them to my Frost army with huge smiles.

They can be fun, but that's all.
The new magic made them better (as the old maw couldn't affect them)
On the other hand in a 2400 points list you will always have:
at least a lord and a BSB
Mostly a hero caster.
That is already atleast 700 points.
600 points of core and an ironblaster leaves 900 points.

In that slot Yhetees have to compete with maneaters, leadbelchers and mournfang, which are all better.
Especially when you use magic missiles and some magic weapons.

The Hexwraith attacks are just Str5 flammable. Which is just about as bad as it gets for Yhetees.

Mournfangs get a 4+ save against the Hex Wraiths and don't care about flaming.

You should really preface statements like this with "I think" or similar.

Hexwraith attacks, both in combat and their move through attacks ignore armour saves. They wreck mournfangs like no tomorrow. The only real defense is the dragonhide's breath.

Really?

I'd never heard that they ignored armor saves till just now. Of course I've never played against them but I would have assumed I'd have heard about that when they first came out.

You learn something new every day.

Nerts. Well, this is all fun. Pity, I was more drawn to the swiftstride than anything but I can see how the Maneaters with it would be a better choice. Lack of Impact hits is something I did notice too...


I never seem to see a lot of flaming attacks, the paranoia over the flaming banner I always felt a bit off since the unit carrying it probably wouldn't end up near the Yhetees instead. I still see Hellpits savaging units and people who tell me Plaguebearers aren't any good can bugger right off.

Anyways, thanks for the advice guys! I was planning for Maneaters to go Poison Sniper since they're still ok in combat and being able to quickly shred an annoying character in the meantime's no bad thing, even if it's just a Hero. So a second lot with Stubborn/Immune to Psych and Swiftstride should be fairly entertaining.

(I also just realised one opponent is a Tomb King player, and I don't know how long it'll be before he begins experimenting with the Lore of Light...)

I do like the models and the extra move but not armor save sucks. Think add hero with big name so he has move 7 also and maybe try a larger unit of yhettees. So 3 fails, but maybe 6-9. Expensive though. Ha, I'm considering s horde of yhettees!!!

No, really, for fun and to try.

its not just the flaming banner but alot of people take lore of fire. That is a sad day for the Ys. Cool model but badly executed. they just dont compete with the other choices. if they were 5 points a model i may take them =). need more attacks and some kind of defence or be  alot cheaper.

The Hexwraith attacks are just Str5 flammable. Which is just about as bad as it gets for Yhetees.

Mournfangs get a 4+ save against the Hex Wraiths and don't care about flaming.

I'm sorry but this can't be more unture. first off Hexwraiths don't care how good your armor save is as their attacks allow no armor saves.

As for the yhetees, well that's a match up I have no problem with. Take min size of both units, yhetees are cheeper by 18 points, have higher I-4, more attacks and don't forget their aura of frost which does come in handly in this match up. You'll need 3s to hit and 2s to kill, using math to give a rough general of the damage a 2/3 of the attacks will hit. So 6 hits then needing 2s to wound you'll more then likely get 5 wounds, 5 dead wraiths before the Hex Wraiths and their flameing attacks are ever a a danger to us.  I take a unit of 6 yhetees, so even if someone takes a unit of 10 hezwraiths(the max size) I have a good chance of killing them off before they can hurt me.

I have seen socalled bad units become unstoppable killing machines, it's all in how you play them.  I think running 4 yhetees and hitting the enemy in the side is a good idea. With 12/13 attacks it can do some real damage if played right, after all you can only have one flaming banner in an army.

Hexwraith attacks, both in combat and their move through attacks ignore armour saves. They wreck mournfangs like no tomorrow. The only real defense is the dragonhide's breath.

There's also toothcracker (+1 Toughness augment from a nearby butcher) ... But yeah, they suck...

As for the yhetees, well that's a match up I have no problem with. Take min size of both units, yhetees are cheeper by 18 points, have higher I-4, more attacks and don't forget their aura of frost which does come in handly in this match up. You'll need 3s to hit and 2s to kill, using math to give a rough general of the damage a 2/3 of the attacks will hit. So 6 hits then needing 2s to wound you'll more then likely get 5 wounds, 5 dead wraiths before the Hex Wraiths and their flameing attacks are ever a a danger to us.  I take a unit of 6 yhetees, so even if someone takes a unit of 10 hezwraiths(the max size) I have a good chance of killing them off before they can hurt me.

Why, oh why, would the Hexwraiths be getting into combat with the Yhetees as opposed to running over them, doing about eight wounds?  Do your VC opponents normally just walk casually into matchups that are going to get them killed when they have the best access to chaff in the game?

As for the yhetees, well that's a match up I have no problem with. Take min size of both units, yhetees are cheeper by 18 points, have higher I-4, more attacks and don't forget their aura of frost which does come in handly in this match up. You'll need 3s to hit and 2s to kill, using math to give a rough general of the damage a 2/3 of the attacks will hit. So 6 hits then needing 2s to wound you'll more then likely get 5 wounds, 5 dead wraiths before the Hex Wraiths and their flameing attacks are ever a a danger to us.  I take a unit of 6 yhetees, so even if someone takes a unit of 10 hezwraiths(the max size) I have a good chance of killing them off before they can hurt me.

Why, oh why, would the Hexwraiths be getting into combat with the Yhetees as opposed to running over them, doing about eight wounds?  Do your VC opponents normally just walk casually into matchups that are going to get them killed when they have the best access to chaff in the game?

I think he means he charges them before they are close enough to fly over them. Maybe repositioning with tusks and stuff etc. can help, but he does have a point. I just feel Yhetis shouldn't be in all comers lists.

I have done a bunch of games with units of yhetees.  They're fun.  I don't think they suck like some people state.  They are certainly outclassed by our other special choices, but they can be good.  They are fast, they hit pretty hard, they have magical attacks, and they can be affected by gut magic.  The best thing to do, imo, is to put toothcracker on them and send them at enemy core.  Core will likely be WS 3, which will get reduced to 2, and if your lucky and they fail a fear check, they go to WS 0.  Against core they are amazing.  A unit of 8 will send out 25 attacks, 3s to hit, 2s to wound, and probably stomp.  They are I 4 so they will likely strike first, so you won't have to worry about losing attacks before you swing.  Use them for fun.  They aren't amazing or anything, but I love running them because they're fun.  Don't use them in a tourney match and you're fine.

Yhetees can be handy if you take 3 units of mannies like i do. besides being flammable they are just as resilient to S4+ attacks as mannies are. I say this as a 5+ armour save becomes a 6+ save which is hardly of any use. 2 small units is nice for supporting the mannies. their main problem is that they need to be carefully used and have no real advantage over mannies besides not needing a banner to give them special rules.

I like running 2 units of 3 yethees from time to time.  Put one on each flank and bash them into the sides of enemy units for combo charge, or go hunt chariots etc.

1 unit of 3 yethees I fielded bagged me about 870 point in a single game once... (Double mortis engin chain explosion in round 6  ) obviously my yethees didn't get out there alive, but they caused the boom!

I swapped out 500 points of maneaters for 500 points of yhetees in my frost list.

I gotta say, I'm not missing the maneaters all that much. The Yhetees so far have done great.. They are so damn fast!

You can make maneaters the same speed of course but I get 12 of Yhetees for the cost of 8 maneaters...

I think the real edge that Yhetees feature over Maneaters is the ability to field a unit of them in either flank, whereas Maneaters can only suit up in that particular kit once per army. The Maneaters are pretty unilaterally superior in every aspect save Wounds, but it's that redundancy factor that keeps the Yhetees at least a little relevant (at least in my mind).

I think the real edge that Yhetees feature over Maneaters is the ability to field a unit of them in either flank, whereas Maneaters can only suit up in that particular kit once per army. The Maneaters are pretty unilaterally superior in every aspect save Wounds, but it's that redundancy factor that keeps the Yhetees at least a little relevant (at least in my mind).

Agreed.

I typically put a unit of 6 in each flank. My opponent has no choice but to deal with them... They hit hard as anything in our army and they are as fast as cavalry.