Ogre tyrant beating a doombull, possible?

Hey all,
I have been trying to create a char to take on his Doombull, price is no option. I am struggling to make a char good enough to beat him, I can either find a way to kill him most of the time but because of his higher I and ASF he kills be before I can kill him and if i buff up def I cant kill him, any good builds.

I am sorry i don't have a accurate build for the Doombull but its along the lines of
1 or 2+ Armour, a 4+ward, Asf, and i feel like i am forgetting something, maybe +1 attack for each save.

You're not far off with the Doombull build, though that armour save is usually re-rollable in order to get even more attacks off it. Your best bet would probably be the usual Tyrant build, Sword of Striking, Greedy Fist and Giantbreaker along with suitable protective gear. With that, you hit on 3s, wound on 2s and negate most of his save, but he'll be hitting on 4s with re-rolls and wounding on 3s with 6 attacks, so it'll be a close thing. If he starts winning combats though, it'll go downhill very quickly.

The other trickster's shard (or whatever it's called) could help for his 4+ ward save...?

I'm thinking of something like: Sword of Striking, Giantbreaker, Heavy magic armor that grants 5+ ward, Enchanted Shield, other trickster's shard.

If you're tailoring to beat this Doombull, I'd say that you have to at least consider the Obsidian Blade. The big thing about the build is that the armor save is going to give you major problems, and if you negate that you have a good chance, particularly with Giantbreaker providing +1S.

As for the possibility of beating him... I'm going to be honest, I don't think any Ogre Tyrant build can really square up to the Ramhorn Doombull and actually be favored to beat him. Crazy things happen in games played with dice, but here you're swimming uphill.

From what your telling me for the doombull try this (I am assuming that he has 2+4++ and the extra attack thingy?)

Great weapon, Giant Breaker, Dawnstone, Armor of silvered steel and Potion of Speed.

He gets no armor save and you have a 75% chance of saving each wound done to you. (Assuming Str5) I would say round two of combat use Pot of speed and take away his rerolls. This is going to be a slugfest but I cant see a better option.

Actually, Rothgar's got a good idea. He's pretty much the Stronghold's resident Beast expert.

Glittering Scales (-1 to hit)
Gold Sigil Sword (get rid of re-rolls)
Tricksters other shard (reroll ward saves)
Greedy Fist (1 Strength, 6+ ward)

Done. This combo has worked to kill the doombull 100% of the zero times I have tried it. Do it. DO IT. DO it. Do IT. doit. doIt. DoIt. DOit. doIT. DO IT.

Gold Sigil Sword does NOT get rid of the re-rolls. It makes you strike at I10, it doesn't in fact give you I10 (which is what matters for the purposes of ASF, same as the Ogre Blade won't give you +2 Strength for a Strength test). The Other Trickster's Shard can also figure to be wasted points against Doombulls who opt for the 1+ re-rollable save over the 4+ Ward, so that may or may not be useful. The one thing that is universal is that you want to get through that armor save, and your choices on that front or either the Obsidian Blade or the Greedy Fist + Giantbreaker + Great Weapon combo. In fact, given that you're striking last anyway and that wounding is at a premium here, I'd say that Greedy Fist + Giantbreaker + Glittering Scales + Great Weapon + Potion of Speed will at least rough the Doombull up.

I'm assuming the potion of speed is to negate the ASF rerolls of the Doombull, since the Great Weapon gives you ASL?  And isn't the Doombull WS7?  The glittering scales are only going to drop that to a 4+ to hit.

How about the Fencer's Blades, Glittering Scales, Potion of Speed, and Potion of Strength?  Pop them both, 6 attacks hitting on 3s, wounding on 2s at strength 8 (so nothing from a 2+ and 6+ from a 1+), being hit on 5+ with no reroll.

@dirtycrabcakes
No no no.  All you have to do is paste the armory from the O&G book into the OK army book, and take the Armor of Gork.  The Doombull can't hurt you with the added D3 Toughness (you DO have the dice with just 5s and 6s printed on it, right?)

Potion of Speed and Potion of Strength are enchanted items.  Can`t take both.

- Snark

Gold Sigil Sword does NOT get rid of the re-rolls. It makes you strike at I10, it doesn't in fact give you I10 (which is what matters for the purposes of ASF, same as the Ogre Blade won't give you +2 Strength for a Strength test).

Really? Is this explicitly stated anywhere or been officially ruled on? This is not an initiative test and seems to go against the spirit of the rule.

Gold sigil sword specifically says attacks MADE from the sword are at I10. Not this model has I10

Gold sigil sword specifically says attacks MADE from the sword are at I10. Not this model has I10

Wow... It's never come up for me since I bunker my BSB (who is the one who usually carries my GSS) in the 2nd rank.

Gold sigil sword specifically says attacks MADE from the sword are at I10. Not this model has I10

what exactly is the difference?

The difference is that you attack with the sword 'as if' you were I10 (meaning first in most cases).  But when you don't attack you have your own normal Ini. 

That means the doombull will still get his re-rolls on his ASF because when he attacks you are I4 again.

So against a ASF doombull the gold sigil sword won't help one bit and you might as well have armed your Tyrant with a flashy stick.

ah I see. That is actually very helpful to know for future games with friends so that such things can be explained

Yeah, it's a fine difference but there are situations where it matters.

Potion of Speed and Potion of Strength are enchanted items.  Can`t take both.

- Snark

Doh!  That's the problem with working the midshift.  You start missing simple things like that.

Yeah, it's a fine difference but there are situations where it matters.

such as against high elves which one of my friend's plays

Just bring two Ironblasters and blast him to pieces 

Doombulls have a better stat-line than a Tyrant... going tot-to-toe is often not great.

You friends build looks to be 1+ save, 4+ ward with sucessful saves earning you a str 6 hit, and asf.

To beat him you need to be very resistant to str 6, and hit him at very high str (to stop the armour hitting you back).

I would suggest: Tricksters Helm, 5+ ward, Tricksters Shard and a Great Weapon. Doombull still has the edge though.

I'm 2-1 against the ramhorn bull, though I confess the math is a coinflip.  My Tyrant runs Fencing Blades, Greedy Fist, and Giant Breaker.  S7 tends to punch through the armor enough to push wounds and the Doombull needing 4s to hit tends to cut down on his damage output.  If (as I did twice) you roll the 6+ ward, the fight swings tremendously in your favor.  Charging is also essential, as the side that gets their impact hits seems to invariably win this engagement.  In any case, you are much better off lobbing a cannonball at this guy.  If you do want to build specifically to beat him, then I suggest Talisman of Preservation, the No Armor Save Sword, and Charmed Shield.

For reference, the build I typically face is:  Ramhorn, ASF sword, Gnarled Hide, Reroll Failed armor item, and OTS.

You're running a Tyrant (ie: higher Ld) against a character who depends a great deal on his saves. Running a Razor Standard in your bunker unit should be a no-brainer. Coupled with a great weapon and Giantbreaker, this will completely negate his armor save. A Talisman of Preservation will double your effective wounds more cheaply than the Fencer's Blades + Glittering Scales (which you can't use anyway because of the GW) and you can run an Other Trickster's Shard to further cut down his survivability.

You'll hit on 4s, wound on 2s and lose 25% of your hits to saves (5/16 wounds per attack), while he hits on re-rolled 3s (8/9 chance), wounds on 3s, and loses 50% of his hits to saves (8/27 wounds per attack). You have a slight edge in wounds/attack, but he does strike first.

You also have 15 points left to spend on Magic Armor which won't in any way affect this combat, but could be useful against something else.

I would actually try to avoid a head on confrontation and sling Death spells and cannonballs his way.

Oh my

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AGHtDjzMSc